Coercive Voice Memo

This week TikTok was talking about a voice note that someone posted in which a man was coercing a woman into promising sex on a second date.

No surprise, people took sides and a whole lot of people didn’t see how it was coercive, while the sex professionals and consent educators did. I sat down over coffee to jot down a transcript and break down what makes it coercive.

Here is the audio with my duet reaction upon the first time hearing it. I used a photo of Andrew Keegan’s character from the movie 10 Things I Hate About You because that’s the image that came to mind while I was listening to it. If you know, you know.

The transcript is highlighted and my notes follow.

I had a good time tonight, I definitely think you’re lovely, um... however…

However. It’s the but. Always stop and pause at the but. Everything before it can be ignored. He didn’t have a great time and he doesn’t think you’re lovely. However… ;) he knows these things will make you feel good so he gives you this validation first to lower your defenses.

I would love to... If we’re gonna go to your place on Thursday...

If. There was already a plan for him to come over Thursday and now it’s an “if” because he’s got another plan.

I mean I am looking to have that um...physical intimacy, um... to see if like, I am sexually compatible with you.

I mean. This is what he means. This is the meaning behind everything he’s about to say. Hold tight to this. No matter what he says next, this is what he means.

Um, so like, if I’m gonna come over, like, I would be hoping to like hook up, have sex, have a good time, like, have that romantic spark and that physical spark there, um...

Me, then you. First he lists what he wants: to hook up, have sex, have a good time. Then he offers something you want (that he doesn’t) — romantic spark. He knows you don’t want the physical and he needs to throw in something for you.

For my own sake, um...

Me Me Me. This is really all about what he wants from you. You’re inconsequential to him.

Because it’s hard for me to continue dating if... dating someone and seeing them if I don’t know if I’m sexually compatible, so um...

Someone. He doesn’t say YOU here, he says “someone” because he’s generalizing to make it less about you personally. You’re more likely to agree if you think he’s like this with everyone (it normalizes it). It also lands less offensively if he’s directing it outward away from you personally.

I know you said, “I don’t know about that.”

I know. He knows what he’s doing. He knows you don’t want sex. He knows you already said no. He knows you’re nervous. He knows you have reservations and he’s actively working to get past them. He can’t play dumb now. He can’t pretend he thought you wanted it.

So I guess my thing is like, what would be the point of me coming over then if we’re not gonna like hook up and like, cuddle, and like, be intimate with each other?

The point. The point is hooking up. He’s saying it again, and again throwing in “cuddle” for your sake, not because it’s what he wants, but because he thinks it softens his language and bit. In the audio you can hear the slight hesitation in his voice right before he says it. The way he says “be intimate” is another attempt to soften what he really means. If you think it’s intimate, you’re more likely to be attracted to that.

Um, and if that’s what you don’t want, that’s fine, but like, I think we should just like, end it here then, respectfully, just because I...

Fine, but. Here he makes it clear that what you want is getting in the way of what he wants and if you don’t change your mind, you’ll never see him again. If you’re a strong confident woman you’ll probably have already seen through this and you’re laughing at him. But if you’re lonely and longing for someone to love you, you’ll feel a pang of rejection at this point. Your nervous system will recall every other time you’ve been rejected and you’ll start to wonder if having sex wouldn’t be so bad and maybe you could. Remember… he knows this.

First date, that’s fine, like, you wanna get to know each other, I’m all about that but I am looking to have that physical aspect there and I don’t wanna continue seeing someone if I don’t know if that’s good. If that’s not there or not.

Word Salad. Now that he’s given you all of his points, he begins to mix them all together into a salad to serve it up to you again in a different way, hoping you won’t notice. “That’s fine” to say it’s really not. “You wanna” to say he doesn’t care about that. He doesn’t care to get to know you. That’s what you want. “I’m all about that” to make you feel like you’re on the same page. But you’re not because he doesn’t want to continue if you don’t do what he wants.

So, up to you, let me know.

Up to you. But it’s really not. He’s made the choice for you with a simple subtle ultimatum. Agree to sex or lose me. But there’s illusion in the choice being yours. Yeah, you could turn him down, but if you like him and want him, you’d be losing any potential future you might have had with him. Again, a secure woman has already seen through this, but if you’re still unsure of yourself, this is the threat. The threat of being “alone with your cats” if you don’t do what he wants.

I’m happy to um... if you do want me to come over, I’m happy to do so,

Happy to. He’s happy to do what he wants, the thing this whole conversation is about. Of course he’s happy about it but he has to frame it as some sort of favor to you. You want him to come over. You want a date. You want a boyfriend. He wants something else.

I would love to fuck, have a good time, and you know, we can have some wine, hang out, and chill.

To fuck. He wants to fuck. That’s it. And oh, look at that… he’ll get you some wine to loosen you up if you’re still not sure.

But if you’re not trying to hook up, then like, I think we should just go out separate ways. Let me know.

If. One last if. If you say no, I withdraw. If you say no, you get no date, no boyfriend. If you say no, you get no intimacy, no cuddles, no romantic spark, or any of the other bullshit he offered.

The Conversation

A lot of points were made and lots of misinformation spread, and most of it from people only mildly experienced with coercion from a bystander perspective. Few had real world experience and far too many defended the message as benign. Some even called it a green flag for its “honesty”, not seeing how manipulative it really was.

• Green Flag - people are saying it’s a green flag that he was so “honest” and direct about his intentions, but if someone’s intentions were to strangle you, we wouldn’t be applauding the honesty. It’s not a green flag to say, “I’ll give you a second date if you agree to let me fuck you.”

• Objectification - When he says “What’s the point?” He’s making it very clear he doesn’t see her as a person and is not interested in getting to know her or even dating her. He wants nothing to do with her except to use her for sexual gratification.

• Confidence - He lacks confidence in his message. He didn’t do this in person when he had the opportunity because he’s not entirely confident about his approach. He knew he was being shady and that’s why he chose to do it with a voice note instead.

• Written Contract - The text message also creates a “paper trail” for him. If she were to respond favorably, he could outright assault her and claim she agreed to it ahead of time. Whether it would hold up in court is irrelevant. All he has to do is tell her it would and she would never press charges. This is one of those things men teach each other, how to get around consent and avoid accusations later.

• Deception - he conflates “intimacy” and romance with sexual gratification to trick her into what will no doubt be strictly intercourse. And he will likely never see her again anyway, depending on whether or not he can successfully convince her to let him carry on this charade longer.

• Boundaries - some are confusing boundaries with ultimatums (as happens every time we have this discussion). Some say he has a right to “express the boundary” of not wanting to date before having sex, but that’s only a boundary if he keeps it to himself. The moment he vocalizes it to her, he’s made it her problem, an ultimatum. A boundary would be for him to say to himself, “She’s not interested in sex like I am so I’m going to bow out and see if I can find someone more compatible.” And ultimatum is to tell her, “I don’t want to continue seeing you until you have sex with me.”

Voice Note from a Husband

For a video, I posted a satirical version of the voice note from the perspective of the coercive men in my comments over the years. This is the same message but in their words. In this, we can see how this is a problem even deep into a long term relationship or marriage.

Yeah, I had a good time tonight. You’re a great wife.

However, if we’re going to do date nights in the future, I’m going to need some, like, physical intimacy.

I need to know we’re still, like, sexually compatible, you know?

Like, if we’re going to do dates, if there’s going to be any romance, I need to, like, have sex with you for my own sake, because it’s hard to, like, be married to you if it doesn’t feel like we’re sexually compatible.

Now I know you said you’re not comfortable having sex with me right now, but I guess my thing is like, what’s the point of us even being married if we’re not having sex?

And if that’s, like, not what you want, then I think we should just end it right here… respectfully. But I’m looking to have that, like, physical aspect, and I don’t want to continue being married to someone if that’s not there.

So, up to you.

Let me know. I’m happy to, like, take you out and then fuck. We can have some wine and, like, hang out and chill.

But if you’re not trying to fuck, then we should just, like, go our own separate ways. Let me know.

More Video Commentary

You can’t give preemptive consent

The most dangerous part of this voice note is the attempt to get consent ahead of time that presumably he would not allow her to revoke later.

Male centered women are the most vulnerable

Women who are lonely and looking for a man are often the first to fall for this kind of thing because like many people, they will see his honesty as “refreshing” and feel a social obligation to at least hear him out. She will also often have an aversion to rejecting men and will not want to hurt his feelings and may go along with him, not because she actually wants to, but because it’s the “right” thing to do if she wants to pursue a possible relationship with him.

The Con

Here I describe the way many men will sandwich a single often uncomfortable truth amidst layers of lies because if you’ve been honest about one thing, you're likely to believe everything else he says.

The Right Way

In this one I explain how I approached Navy Guy to have a sexual relationship. The difference is that it was important to me that we both respect each other as humans and that we do it under the assumption that we’d be forming a friendship as well.